Group read: Curious, If True by Elizabeth Gaskell / The Lifted Veil by George Eliot
TalkVirago Modern Classics
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2lyzard
Welcome to the resumption of the Virago Chronological Read Project and to our next group read. :)
Since this time we will be dealing with, in total, six short works, we will need to adopt a different approach from usual for our group reads.
In planning this group read, and taking into account the suggestions of our participants, it was agreed to extend the project into November in order to give each story equal weight.
I am going to suggest that, as we did for The Executor, The Rector and The Doctor's Family, at the outset of our reads of Margaret Oliphant's 'Chronicles of Carlingford', we assign a block of time within which each story is read and comments posted, in order to keep the discussion as complete and coherent as possible.
Provisionally, our schedule will be as follows:
The Old Nurse's Story by Elizabeth Gaskell: 1st - 7th October
The Poor Clare by Elizabeth Gaskell: 8th - 14th October
Lois The Witch by Elizabeth Gaskell: 15th - 21st October
The Grey Woman by Elizabeth Gaskell: 22nd - 28th October
Curious, If True by Elizabeth Gaskell: 29th - 4th November
The Lifted Veil by George Eliot: 5th - 12th November
However, if a week per story seems excessive, please speak up now and we can adjust our plans.
While I believe this project will work best if we keep the discussion segregated as much as possible, I don't want to dissuade those who need to start late or who can't be here all the way through from participating: if you need to post "out of order", do so, but please mark your posts clearly in bold.
Similarly, if you prefer to read the stories more quickly, by all means do so, but please confine your comments to the assigned periods unless you can't get back to post.
If this plan doesn't work for you or if you have some alternative suggestions, please say so now while we have the opportunity to make adjustments.
Since this time we will be dealing with, in total, six short works, we will need to adopt a different approach from usual for our group reads.
In planning this group read, and taking into account the suggestions of our participants, it was agreed to extend the project into November in order to give each story equal weight.
I am going to suggest that, as we did for The Executor, The Rector and The Doctor's Family, at the outset of our reads of Margaret Oliphant's 'Chronicles of Carlingford', we assign a block of time within which each story is read and comments posted, in order to keep the discussion as complete and coherent as possible.
Provisionally, our schedule will be as follows:
The Old Nurse's Story by Elizabeth Gaskell: 1st - 7th October
The Poor Clare by Elizabeth Gaskell: 8th - 14th October
Lois The Witch by Elizabeth Gaskell: 15th - 21st October
The Grey Woman by Elizabeth Gaskell: 22nd - 28th October
Curious, If True by Elizabeth Gaskell: 29th - 4th November
The Lifted Veil by George Eliot: 5th - 12th November
However, if a week per story seems excessive, please speak up now and we can adjust our plans.
While I believe this project will work best if we keep the discussion segregated as much as possible, I don't want to dissuade those who need to start late or who can't be here all the way through from participating: if you need to post "out of order", do so, but please mark your posts clearly in bold.
Similarly, if you prefer to read the stories more quickly, by all means do so, but please confine your comments to the assigned periods unless you can't get back to post.
If this plan doesn't work for you or if you have some alternative suggestions, please say so now while we have the opportunity to make adjustments.
3lyzard
In addition to her novels, Elizabeth Gaskell wrote numerous short stories, many of them with a supernatural theme and most of them, overtly or covertly, dealing with aspects of women's lives.
Gaskell's stories have been collected and re-collected ever since the 1860s, and there are many variant editions that contain some of these five, if not all.
Though Gaskell had her difficulties with Charles Dickens as her editor, his magazines Household Words and All The Year Round were an important vehicle for her fiction, all the more so since short stories were less restricted with respect to subject matter and tone.
Gaskell was invited by Dickens to contribute a story to the 1852 Christmas edition of Household Words, released under the variant title of A Round of Stories by the Christmas Fire: this was the first publication of The Old Nurse's Story.
The Poor Clare also appeared first in Household Words, in three parts during 1856; while Lois The Witch was published in All The Year Round during 1859, also in three parts.
Curious, If True first appeared in The Cornhill Magazine in February in 1860.
In 1861, the publisher Bernhard Tauchnitz collected five of Gaskell's stories as Lois The Witch and Other Tales: this volume marked the first publication of The Grey Woman.
There is a suggestion out there that there was also a collection of Gaskell's stories released under the title "Curious, If True" in 1861, but I have so far been unable to establish this.
The Virago edition of 1995 appears to be the first time that these five particular stories were collected together; however, the 2000 Penguin release Gothic Tales collects these five and four others.
There are various ebook releases that include our five stories including one from Project Gutenberg.
Gaskell's stories have been collected and re-collected ever since the 1860s, and there are many variant editions that contain some of these five, if not all.
Though Gaskell had her difficulties with Charles Dickens as her editor, his magazines Household Words and All The Year Round were an important vehicle for her fiction, all the more so since short stories were less restricted with respect to subject matter and tone.
Gaskell was invited by Dickens to contribute a story to the 1852 Christmas edition of Household Words, released under the variant title of A Round of Stories by the Christmas Fire: this was the first publication of The Old Nurse's Story.
The Poor Clare also appeared first in Household Words, in three parts during 1856; while Lois The Witch was published in All The Year Round during 1859, also in three parts.
Curious, If True first appeared in The Cornhill Magazine in February in 1860.
In 1861, the publisher Bernhard Tauchnitz collected five of Gaskell's stories as Lois The Witch and Other Tales: this volume marked the first publication of The Grey Woman.
There is a suggestion out there that there was also a collection of Gaskell's stories released under the title "Curious, If True" in 1861, but I have so far been unable to establish this.
The Virago edition of 1995 appears to be the first time that these five particular stories were collected together; however, the 2000 Penguin release Gothic Tales collects these five and four others.
There are various ebook releases that include our five stories including one from Project Gutenberg.
4lyzard
The publication history of George Eliot's The Lifted Veil is more straightforward: it was first published anonymously in Blackwood's Magazine in 1859; however, the 1878 "Cabinet" edition including Eliot's own revisions is now considered the standard text.
There have been numerous releases of The Lifted Veil since, from Penguin and the Oxford University Press in addition to Virago, often in conjunction with another shorter work by Eliot.
There are also many ebook versions, again including one from Project Gutenberg.
There have been numerous releases of The Lifted Veil since, from Penguin and the Oxford University Press in addition to Virago, often in conjunction with another shorter work by Eliot.
There are also many ebook versions, again including one from Project Gutenberg.
5lyzard
I will leave it here for now.
Please check in and let us know if you will be participating or lurking, whether the proposed schedule works for you or, if not, what your alternative suggestion would be.
Again let me stress that if you cannot participate immediately or all the way through, we still want you! - just let us know and we'll do our best to accommodate you. :)
Please check in and let us know if you will be participating or lurking, whether the proposed schedule works for you or, if not, what your alternative suggestion would be.
Again let me stress that if you cannot participate immediately or all the way through, we still want you! - just let us know and we'll do our best to accommodate you. :)
6NinieB
I'm here! I have borrowed the Virago edition from the library. I think a week per story will work well for me.
8CDVicarage
I've got ebook versions of both and the Virago edition of The Lifted Veil.
9Tess_W
I'm gonna try! Traditionally, I'm not good with following a schedule! I have the Penguin Classic Edition of Gaskell and the audio version of Eliot. I read The Lifted Veil in 2022, but am not opposed to a re-read. Thanks to Kathy for alerting me to this group read.
10Majel-Susan
I'd love to join! A story a week sounds reasonable, though my work schedule is very variable this month, but I'll try to keep up.
I've just downloaded my copy from Project Gutenberg.
I've just downloaded my copy from Project Gutenberg.
11lyzard
>6 NinieB:, 7, 8, 9, 10
Welcome Ninie, Kathy, Kerry, Tess and Janet - great to see you all here!
>9 Tess_W:
Thank you for joining the group, Tess. Hopefully this schedule gives you enough room to manoeuvre, however if it doesn't please read along and add your comments anyway.
>10 Majel-Susan:
I hope it works for you, Janet!
Welcome Ninie, Kathy, Kerry, Tess and Janet - great to see you all here!
>9 Tess_W:
Thank you for joining the group, Tess. Hopefully this schedule gives you enough room to manoeuvre, however if it doesn't please read along and add your comments anyway.
>10 Majel-Susan:
I hope it works for you, Janet!
12lyzard
I will wait a little longer before I start the discussion of The Old Nurse's Story, as I know some people will only get to check in on Monday. We'll see if we get any more takers before we make a start.
14lyzard
Discussion begins here for The Old Nurse's Story.
When commenting, feel free either to highlight aspects of the story, or simply to post your reaction to it overall.
Though I'm hoping for some good discussion points. :)
When commenting, feel free either to highlight aspects of the story, or simply to post your reaction to it overall.
Though I'm hoping for some good discussion points. :)
15lyzard
The first thing that struck me was that it was atmospheric without being forced: a big house mostly neglected but with areas better cared for was common enough where money was restricted and servants few, but it still sets up a sense of "a house divided" (and a bit spooky):
...then we saw a great and stately house, with many trees close around it, so close that in some places their branches dragged against the walls when the wind blew; and some hung broken down; for no one seemed to take much charge of the place;---to lop the wood, or to keep the moss-covered carriage-way in order. Only in front of the house all was clear. The great oval drive was without a weed; and neither tree nor creeper was allowed to grow over the long, many-windowed front; at both sides of which a wing protected, which were each the ends of other side fronts; for the house, although it was so desolate, was even grander than I expected. Behind it rose the Fells; which seemed unenclosed and bare enough; and on the left hand of the house, as you stood facing it, was a little, old-fashioned flower-garden, as I found out afterwards. A door opened out upon it from the west front; it had been scooped out of the thick, dark wood for some old Lady Furnivall; but the branches of the great forest-trees had grown and overshadowed it again, and there were very few flowers that would live there at that time...
...then we saw a great and stately house, with many trees close around it, so close that in some places their branches dragged against the walls when the wind blew; and some hung broken down; for no one seemed to take much charge of the place;---to lop the wood, or to keep the moss-covered carriage-way in order. Only in front of the house all was clear. The great oval drive was without a weed; and neither tree nor creeper was allowed to grow over the long, many-windowed front; at both sides of which a wing protected, which were each the ends of other side fronts; for the house, although it was so desolate, was even grander than I expected. Behind it rose the Fells; which seemed unenclosed and bare enough; and on the left hand of the house, as you stood facing it, was a little, old-fashioned flower-garden, as I found out afterwards. A door opened out upon it from the west front; it had been scooped out of the thick, dark wood for some old Lady Furnivall; but the branches of the great forest-trees had grown and overshadowed it again, and there were very few flowers that would live there at that time...
16lyzard
When the organ music starts, I like that Hester never tries to convince herself that she is "hearing things", and in fact refuses to pretend she's not hearing what she's hearing, no matter that the others have been schooled into it:
As winter drew on, and the days grew shorter, I was sometimes almost certain that I heard a noise as if someone was playing on the great organ in the hall. I did not hear it every evening; but, certainly, I did very often, usually when I was sitting with Miss Rosamond, after I had put her to bed, and keeping quite still and silent in the bedroom... I held my peace till I was with Dorothy alone, when I knew I could get a good deal out of her. So, the next day, I watched my time, and I coaxed and asked her who it was that played the organ; for I knew that it was the organ and not the wind well enough, for all I had kept silence before James...
****
...it rose above the great gusts of wind, and wailed and triumphed just like a living creature, and then it fell to a softness most complete, only it was always music, and tunes, so it was nonsense to call it the wind. I thought at first, that it might be Miss Furnivall who played, unknown to Bessy; but one day, when I was in the hall by myself, I opened the organ and peeped all about it and around it, as I had done to the organ in Crosthwaite church once before, and I saw it was all broken and destroyed inside, though it looked so brave and fine; and then, though it was noon-day, my flesh began to creep a little, and I shut it up, and run away pretty quickly to my own bright nursery...
As winter drew on, and the days grew shorter, I was sometimes almost certain that I heard a noise as if someone was playing on the great organ in the hall. I did not hear it every evening; but, certainly, I did very often, usually when I was sitting with Miss Rosamond, after I had put her to bed, and keeping quite still and silent in the bedroom... I held my peace till I was with Dorothy alone, when I knew I could get a good deal out of her. So, the next day, I watched my time, and I coaxed and asked her who it was that played the organ; for I knew that it was the organ and not the wind well enough, for all I had kept silence before James...
****
...it rose above the great gusts of wind, and wailed and triumphed just like a living creature, and then it fell to a softness most complete, only it was always music, and tunes, so it was nonsense to call it the wind. I thought at first, that it might be Miss Furnivall who played, unknown to Bessy; but one day, when I was in the hall by myself, I opened the organ and peeped all about it and around it, as I had done to the organ in Crosthwaite church once before, and I saw it was all broken and destroyed inside, though it looked so brave and fine; and then, though it was noon-day, my flesh began to creep a little, and I shut it up, and run away pretty quickly to my own bright nursery...
